Nicholas Johnson "All things considered" segment about the Democratic National Convention, New York City, New York, July 12, 1976

Bob Edwards: Sitting in the back rows now, Madison Square Garden, New York with Nicholas Johnson, former FCC commissioner and NPR television commentator. Nick, what do you make of this scene in front of us right now? (laughs) Nick Johnson: Well, what they've really done here is to create television stations. They've spent, I gather, something like a $10 to $30 million depending on how much you count, since the nomination itself is a well known, long in advance, the real competition here, the real battle is between NBC and CBS rather than for the presidency. It's for the ratings and the delegates and this whole convention is really sort of incidental to that. You know, they could be fighting over a rodeo coverage or an auto race or a Superbowl or a bull fight. It just happens to be politics that they chosen to square off against each other and determine who goes into the fall with the ratings edge. Bob Edwards: You've mentioned the expense and of course there's a great commitment and time and personnel as well. What does all this mean to the network? Nick Johnson: Well, what's really going on here as viewers watch and listen to the coverage shift throughout this convention is quite seriously is a contest between the networks, principally CBS and NBC. ABC is essentially opted out of the gavel to gavel coverage and is decided to go ahead with business as usual. They've got a ballgame to cover Tuesday night, they're going up to Montreal for the Olympics. There's a limit to how many places you can send 100% of your camera crews and that's essentially what CBS and NBC have done. They've virtually emptied out their those bureaus and brought them all here. They brought some people in from overseas. ABC, it's more business as usual. They're running a summary each evening with a little bit of live coverage. So NBC and CBS are squaring off here really to determine who can get the edge on the ratings, who can get the largest audience to watch them and their coverage of this convention and the lore within the broadcasting circles is that the network that gets the highest ratings in the convention coverage is the network that will go into the fall with a leading edge on the ratings in their news coverage. And this in turn gets spilled over into the flow through audience throughout the evening as people watch the evening news on either CBS or NBC and then stick with that network throughout the rest of the night. So what's really going on here is I indicate is not very much competition in terms of who the Democrats are going to nominate for president. The real competition is who the American people are going to nominate as the ratings leader in the fall with all that means for the networks, roughly a million dollars per rating point. Bob Edwards: NPR, TV commentator, Nicholas Johnson, who would be with us all this week at the 1976 Democratic convention in Madison Square Garden. Our TV commentator, Nicholas Johnson is with us once again. Nick, I understand you've been around to the various network headquarters around the convention hall and what have you found? Nick Johnson: Well, first of all, that this is a convention of TV journalists and other kinds of journalists, ten thousands of them here, far more than there are delegates to the convention in the conventional sense. This is a media event. One named a commentator whose name I will protect and (laughs) his reputation I will protect, suggested they thought it really was a non-event that they were giving an entirely too much coverage so that if we were to spend $200,000 uncovering what's going on in Africa right now, the American people will be much better off than what we're giving them from this convention hall. And notice the way that Carter participated in the campaign. He watched television and watched all three television sets. That's exactly what I did last night. While you were sitting here, I was off watching television and we have a little different view of the convention as a result of that. Bob Edwards: Did it seem to you to be a made for TV agenda or what? Nick Johnson: Well, very much so. I think there was speculation amongst some very professional public relations people watch in New York this morning, and that perhaps the contrast between Glen and Jordan was something that in fact had been orchestrated by that great TV producer in the Americana named Jimmy Carter. Every moment, every hour of this is a prime time coverage that has been accorded. The democratic party is designed to achieve some purpose and the purpose last evening was to nail down the black vote, and certainly the response to a Barbara Jordan, it was over overpowering. The question was the extent to which it was orchestrated. We know it also that each of the canvas, Jerry Brown has a trailer here. Jimmy Carter of course has three trailers that they are located right in the heart of the television command centers for the three networks. Again, it seems to me a significant, a little touch. The attitude of the people covering the convention treats this very much as if it were a TV production studio, which of course it is, the producer leaning out of the CBS booth yesterday shouting to the delegates to please sit down cause they're in the way. The picture sounded very much like the sort of thing I would hear out in Hollywood and a production set. Bob Edwards: About the readings, Nick, who won? Nick Johnson: Well, that's really what this story is all about. As we've said before, Bob's a competition between the networks, not the competition between the candidates accounts here and that competition is fierce. Each of the networks has a press office. I've been working with those press offices. They've been very helpful, but it's interesting that they do care about their clippings. They do care about the coverage of this. They are concerned about who's coming out on top. I think the big question is going to come tonight when ABC has the all star baseball game on. Incidentally, the ABC reporters are all out doing rain dances, praying that it's going to rain, that they will get some time on television. They don't like the idea that they're being cut back in their professional careers and the coverage according to ABC. I got the overnights for last night as they're called the ratings. A CBS came in on top in terms of the three network coverage throughout the night and the CVS is very happy about that. They're high level executive meetings all up and down at the network headquarters this morning and talking about this, but the real winner was ABC. ABC came in with a 29 to a 34 share of audience in the 8:00 to 9:30 period when they were running a movie called the Future Cop. The future cop absolutely swamped CVS and NBC, from 9:30 to 10:30 Casablanca was showing on an independent channel here at channel 11 in New York and did much better even in the Future Cop. It came in with a 31 share and again just absolutely swamped the networks. ABC came in strong at 9:30 with a 6.6 rating and an 11 share dropped off from 10:00 to 10:30 with a 3.2 rating and a 6 share far behind CBS and NBC. Now, whether that's a flow through from the movie, the audience sticking with the channel and then switching or whether it's a feature of the summary that ABC provided between 9:30 and 10:00, there's no way of knowing exactly when that audience did switch over. So a lot of debate about that amongst the networks right now. This morning, I happened to be of the view that the ABC coverage between 9:30 and 10:00 was very good and that those watching during that time got about as much as anybody watching from 8:00 to 10:00. But later on in the evening, they were not doing so well and they were trying to provide the same kind of live coverage. So the big test comes tonight on that Bob and everybody's watching with a lot of excitement. What will happen when ABC puts the all star game up against the democratic all-stars here at Madison Square Garden. Bob Edwards: I was just thinking, Humphrey Bogart is pretty stiff competition, but John Glenn, but about your vote Nick, who gets your vote for last night's coverage? Nick Johnson: Well, I gave a different votes to different networks. I thought NBC did the best job on the visuals. I thought CBS did the best job on the commentary, I thought that ABC did the best job on the editing and on the production. This is after all a media show it ought to be produced. ABC does produce it. They've got Goldwater to provide some entertainment as well as some balance. I talked with Senator George McGovern this morning who's going to be doing the same job for ABC on a Kansas city through Republican convention as you may know. It raises a big question whether you ought to cover the thing from start to finish it, but after all, if you watch CBS and NBC, you don't see it from start to finish either. You see what that fellow in the control booth wants you to see, so they're all producing a show for us and ABC is trying to put it into a little shorter compass and is clearly the one that's carrying the money to the bank this week. Bob Edwards: TV commentator, Nicholas Johnson. Thank you. This is Bob Edwards of Madison Square Garden. TV commentator, Nicholas Johnson is with us once again. Nick, how's the ratings battle going with the nightly convention coverage? Nick Johnson: Well, tonight of course the big question is going to be whether let's make a deal and Bionic Woman on ABC are going to do well against The Six Million Dollar man. Whatever Jimmy Carter is by now in terms of his campaign expenditures. ABC will be leading with that at 7:30 and coming in with the convention coverage at 9:00. NBC will be starting a 7:00, CBS 7:30, those are all Eastern times. You know, one of the aspects of this whole business that we haven't talked about so far is when you get this very close intertwining between a political party, whether it's Democrats or Republicans and the networks, what happens to the media issues in a platform now the Democrats considered a platform last night. It's very significant. It seems to me that there is no discussion in there of a children's television, of violence and television, of how we appointed FCC commissioners of cable television. In fact, the only reference whatsoever is at least an agreement that they're not going to abolish public broadcasting for which I suppose we should be grateful. This is not because these issues were not presented to them. The national citizens communications lobby has a platform on communications issues which was endorsed by the Iowa Democratic Party. It's been endorsed by numerous candidates across the United States. Jimmy Carter staff has been presented this platform on two occasions, has never responded to it. The Democratic National Committee, a platform committee, did not respond to it, did not offer an opportunity to testify. Bob Edwards: Back here on the convention floor, everyone still seems to be very much aware of the television coverage or even Humphrey mentioned that right off last night, alluding to thanking Bob Strauss for putting him up against the all-star game. Nick Johnson: Well, that was the big story last night in terms of the media was ABC's walking away with the ratings with the all star game up against the convention. The Democrats would've done well to have played out their role in the athletic arena and in Philadelphia instead of the one here in New York city. President Ford was in Philadelphia, got very good television exposure on ABC, much better than the Democrats here between 8:00 and 11:00 PM in New York city last night. We just have received the overnights. CBS and NBC combined had a mere 15% of that audience. Bob Edwards: What's in that 15% by the way? Nick Johnson: Well, that's an interesting factor because what's happening is that there are more sets in use. Just like during the Watergate hearings, people thought the viewing was going to fall off because they lose a soap opera audience. In fact, they picked up people who weren't watching before and you know what Network Executives fail to realize they're constantly competing for that 100 million people who are watching television. What they don't recognize is that at any given moment there are 100 million people who aren't watching television, who select off as their favorite channel. What's happening during this convention is the people who are coming to television who weren't watching television at all before, total sets in use are up. And this accounts, I think, for the ratings of those who are watching the convention coverage, CBS has been coming in ahead of NBC each evening by a significant margin and as I watched the coverage. It seems to me that ABC and NBC are going for that 100 million who've been watching television. CBS is providing a coverage, which at least in my judgment is more designed for people who are tuning in just to watch a convention and that may account for the fact that they are getting a bigger share of that convention. Bob Edwards: Meanwhile, ABC is walking off with the commercial money. Nick Johnson: Well that raises some very real problems in my mind. I think that it's appropriate that the American people have a choice of what they watch. I don't think they ought to be forced fed on all three networks, a president or a convention, nominating a president. But I also think that these networks have to share equally the economic burdens of political coverage and they are not now doing so. ABC is taking gross economic advantage of the situation. It pays absolutely no penalty for it whatsoever. CBS and NBC are out an enormous amount of money and they're getting no credit for it. What I'd like to see as a result of this experience and talking with some of the network representatives today, system where the FCC would provide that each one of the three networks would have to provide a minimum number of hours of coverage per year in an election year in prime time of political coverage. That could be a primaries, election eve coverage, conventions, talk shows, inauguration, whatever. But a total say of 70 hours, that's about what CBS and NBC are providing now, to be programmed as the network chooses. No direction from the FCC whatsoever as to who gets on the air, when it's scheduled, what's covered, how it's covered, that's up to the networks. Bob Edwards: TV commentator Nicholas Johnson. This is Bob Edwards in Madison Square Garden. Susan: NPR media critic Nicholas Johnson has been commenting on television's coverage of the convention for us, so a week, we've been hearing you from Madison Square Garden, Nick. Now, here you're in Washington, you couldn't take it anymore. (laughs) Nick Johnson: I know, that's right. I'll have something to say about that a little later. Susan: Okay. What was for today? What was the top story? Nick Johnson: Well, a top story today, of course, was that a hour this morning, the Democrats picked up one more hour of a nationwide television, all three networks. ABC was there as well, 10:00 to 11:00 with Carter's announcement of Mondale's as Vice President. Nicely orchestrated I thought, and well carried off as a TV event. Susan: I want to talk with you a bit now about the visual aspect of this convention that we're watching. Nick Johnson: A lot of things to watch when you're watching the show. Watch for example, the difference between the way the shots the networks pick, if you tend to shoot from underneath the speaker, this is a way of making the speaker look more dominant, more powerful, more inspiring, so that if the network is shooting from underneath, they're trying to build up the speaker, if they're shooting from on top or a long shot rather than a close shot, a tight shot, or if they're going straight on. This says something about what they're trying to sell. Susan: So, it's an editorial statement that they're making through the choice of the angle. Nick Johnson: Well, it sure is. And another thing that's a very important here is how you cover the crowd of while the speaker speaking. For example, if you focus on the delegates who are milling around and there are always some delegates milling around. I don't care who's on the podium. That suggests one thing about the speaker. If you focus on some very intent faces, that tells you something else about the speaker. Susan: Mm-hmm (affirmative) There was an extraordinary series of minutes last night when we saw Jimmy Carter in his hotel room, watching himself go over the top in terms of delegate numbers, watching that on television, and we saw Carter watching television, watching Carter. Nick Johnson: That's right. And at one point a Cronkite says something about Carter and Carter smiles and Cronkite says, I wonder if he's smiling because he's seeing what we've just said. Carter watching his wife on television saying that she wishes she could be with him. Well, so far as we are concerned, she is with him. So far as he is concerned, she's with him. But so far as she's concerned, he's not, we get into a television of television, of television kind of thing. And I don't know that we've got the language to describe it, but it's an interesting... Susan: What about the length of coverage, they went on forever [crosstalk] Nick Johnson: You know when I talked to one of the press representatives of one of the networks, he got very testy about the suggestion that perhaps there's a little too much coverage. I stayed up last night to see how it closed, because before I'd gone to bed a little early, I have to admit, and I noticed that it doesn't close. It's like that old story about some people who leave without saying goodbye and others who go on saying goodbye and never leave. Susan: (laughs) Nick Johnson: It turns out television goes on saying goodbye, it never leaves. The delegates had left, the proceedings were over and there's Severide and Moyers and Brinkley and the Chancellor, carrying all of this conversation, for who? Why? Susan: What are they covering? Nick Johnson: Yeah, precisely. Susan: You're here, now. So presumably a watch this evening, the acceptance speeches and all on television. Is that going to be better than being there? Nick Johnson: Well, I really think it is. It's an amazing thing, Susan. I was in New York Monday night, I watched a television. Last night, I watched television. Tuesday night, I went to the hall and milled around. Well, there's something nice about being there, but I really have much less sense of what happened Tuesday night than I do of what happened Monday and Wednesday. Susan: Yeah. Nick Johnson: And I noticed that even the print press that's there is watching television. They're sitting in the garden, but they're watching television. Susan: Because television gives it structure, that's it. Nick Johnson: Well, it really does and tells them what's going on, enables them to write the stories that we read. Susan: But on the subject of the Pennsylvania Carter caucus came up with a wild resolution today. Nick Johnson: Well, that's right. They suggested that since the media does dominate after all and television, that in the future we shouldn't have delegates except representatives of the press, that they should be delegates the press should select who sits in the hall, that the delegates are nothing but extras on a television set Susan: (laughs) Nick Johnson: and we'd let the networks convene and the local media would be selected as delegates for who's [inaudible 00:17:25]. It was a very imaginative notion, but I think it does highlight what it is we've been talking about here all week. Susan: Thanks very much. NPR media commentator, Nicholas Johnson. The four day television spectacle is over and it's back to reruns on the smallest screen. Also time for the reviews to come in on the four day show. Our reviewer is Nicholas Johnson. Nick Johnson: I couldn't help but think as I watched last night, the final day of the coverage be reminded of a Broadway play some years ago called The Selling of the President based on Joe McGinniss' book, which was set in a theater designed to look like a TV studio during which the audience watched the progression of a Nebraska Senator as he became a United States presidential candidate, and the changes that were made in him by his media advisors through the process of developing commercials for selling him to the American people, and the purpose of our doing this show, I had sort of a tangential relationship with it. We hoped that people would leave the theater saying, "Wow, isn't that something that they can do to you with those manipulated devices and those commercials?", Instead, what happened was as they left he said, "Gee, wasn't he a terrific candidate?" Susan: (Laughs) Nick Johnson: Don't you wish we really had somebody running for president like that. Susan: So it did it to them too. Nick Johnson: It did it to them, and as a result the Broadway show was a total flop because it didn't really accomplish it's purpose and I thought last night as I was watching like those people who left the selling of the president theater, I too fell at the end of it that Carter was a really terrific guy, and I sort of did a double take at that moment and wondered whether the extent to which I had been taken in by the extent to which it was really a very substantive in there. Susan: It's funny that you're using this sort of theater metaphor games, [inaudible] about that the other day at the time he said Jimmy Carter is opening on Broadway when it goes into Madison Square Garden and it was like that at the end especially. Nick Johnson: Yeah. Here they all come for their curtain calls and Bob Strauss calling out the names of all the stars of the prior weeks of performance and they come up on stage and take their bows. I think both from the standpoint of Democratic national committee and from the standpoint of the other commercial networks, they both conceived of it as a production, which indeed it was. Susan: Yeah. Okay. They've closed in New York, they're going to open in Kansas city pretty soon. Different parties, same story in a way. What's going to happen? Nick Johnson: Well, for one thing, they've got a technical side to this that we haven't talked about at all this week when I was viewing the CBS facilities there, I was showing this enormous collection of cables. I mean just thousands and thousands and thousands of cables, like a lot of spaghetti, they're all black, they're not color-coded. They're not tagged. How these fellows know what connects with what, we're across town and in the trailers and in the studios and somehow it all connects and they throw the switch and the right things happen. They've now got to move all that to Kansas city. [inaudible] Susan: What should we be watching for between now and not only Kansas city time, but also between now and November in terms of Gerald Ford, nobody's been paying attention to him lately. Nick Johnson: Well and that because they haven't been paying attention to him lately. That's why he's been staging some media events of his own. And I think that's what we're going to see and it's obviously what his advisors are telling him to do. And that is to try to use the office of the presidency in its ceremonial role is attendance of the all star game Tuesday night, which got much higher ratings than the Democratic national convention. And today is bringing the Indians into the White House asking if they'd please wear their ceremonial dress, which is not really necessary to the visit. And some Indians are complaining Susan: yeah Nick Johnson: that they are in fact being used as props, much as the delegates were being used as props at the convention. I think we'll see more of that. Viewers can watch for that, figure out when you see the President on the television set, how has he gotten himself there, and of course so to ask the same thing about Carter, but the advantage that the President has is that he is both a candidate and a President. Whereas all that Carter is now is a candidate. Susan: mm-hmm (affirmative) Nick Johnson: He will be so conceived by the American people and by the television networks. Susan: Good. Nick, thanks a lot for this. It's been a useful week it took with you and we'll do it again when August comes. Nick Johnson: Great. Susan: NPR media commentator Nicholas Johnson.