Nicholas Johnson interview on KCBS, San Francisco, California, November 28, 1967

Dave: For 2000, check your phone book under beneficial: beneficial finance company. Nicholas Johnson has accused the medium which he regulates of building more walls than bridges between the white and black communities in our cities. He's on our KCBS line. Good morning, Mr. Johnson. Mr. Johnson: Good morning Dave. I'm glad to see we're finally through the commercials. Dave: You really know how to hurt a guy, don't you? Mr. Johnson: No, that's what makes the station go round. Dave: That's what they tell me. Mr. Johnson: Sure. You got to have income. Dave: Well now what about this, this allegation? Do you mean that the type of programming on television and radio presented alienates the American Negro? Mr. Johnson: Well, I think there are a number of factors involved that, Dave, I think on the one hand that at least the surveys that have been done, the comments that I have heard from Negros and and Negro leaders is that there is a feeling on the part of many Negroes, whether or not justified. Mr. Johnson: I'm not saying it's justified, I'm just now talking about attitudes, but there is a feeling that the media is very much a white press, a white broadcasting industry, that the Negro does not have a voice, that he is not represented, that he is essentially alienated from the media in America. Dave: You mean in the programming or also behind the scenes? Mr. Johnson: Well, both I think. Out of some 7,000 radio and television stations in America there are no more than a three or half a dozen that are owned by Negroes. Very few Negroes in management, very few Negroes on camera as personalities or are interviewed or entertainers or in commercials or in soap operas or entertainment shows. It's partly a matter of a number of Negro faces that they see on television, but as I say, this does seem to be an attitude that needs to be dealt with as such. As I indicated, whether or not it's justified, it does seem to be a prevalent attitude and that itself is a factor then that has to be dealt with. Now what you do about it, is something else again. I think employment, as you referred to, is a factor. The broadcasting industry's record in this score is, without passing any moral judgment on it, not very impressive. I think there's some 3.4% of broadcasting's employees who are Negros compared with the nationwide average of 10.8%, so broadcasting has roughly one third as many Negro employees as American industry generally. Dave: Well because of the incredible impact of the communications industry on all phases of our life, do you think that if a drastic change were brought about that this would would help the relationship really very much? Mr. Johnson: Well, I think that broadcasting is just so terribly important in the United States today, radio and television, that it's very difficult to discuss any problem in our society without discussing it in terms of its relationship to broadcasting. I think that the social and political issues that we take an interest in, a large measure are a result of broadcasting's interesting us in them in the first place. Mr. Johnson: I think the kinds of products that we surround ourselves with, the cultural standards we set for ourselves, the kind of education we get, the information we have, the feelings we possess, our largest measure, the creation of the broadcasting industry, whether or not by design again is really irrelevant. But when you realize that one half of the non-working waking time of every American is spent on the average before the television set, you realize that this is bound to have a tremendous impact, and certainly this is true of racial relations in the United States. If there is in fact an understanding gap, a failure of communications, the racial problem is often described as a breakdown in communications, that I think that broadcasting is going to have to take up a large measure of the responsibility for that as they would for any other comparable phenomenon in our country. I think the reason Harris, Lou Harris poll indicated, for example, just as an illustration of the magnitude of what I've called the understanding gap, that there is simply a failure of communication between whites and Negroes on for example, the causes of Negro rioting. Dave: And that's the way it looks to FCC commissioner Nicholas Johnson and his report, gee we just didn't have time to ask. I wanted to see if he had an inside tip on that McNamara story from Washington. Speaker 3: [00:04:51 singing]